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I'm An Anarchist, I Don't Own Myself by bacchist

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· @bacchist · (edited)
$236.69
I'm An Anarchist, I Don't Own Myself
No, I do not "own myself." It is not possible for myself or any other person or entity to "own" me, because **I am not a piece of property**. I am not a *what*, I am a *who*. I will resist any attempt to replace my humanity with a marketable equivalent.

Likewise, I reject any attempt to classify my activity as "labor." I do what I find useful and beneficial; to myself, the people in my life, society as a whole, and the earth and nature which sustains us. "Labor" is an abstraction; a feature of the capitalist mode of production.

As I reject any suggestion that I am a thing which can be owned, I reject the idea that my autonomy is a marketable commodity. I recognize any attempt by another to dictate my activity as an impingement on my freedom.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/73/Broken-chains.png

To put it another way, any effort of another to appropriate my personal autonomy is inherently coercive. I am inseparable from my autonomy. Denial of personal autonomy requires force or the threat of force.

Persuasion is the method of influencing another's behavior in a way that respects and reinforces their autonomy. While I reject any claim of another to "own" my autonomy, they are always welcome to persuade me to adopt a certain course of action.

If somehow a person has allowed me to sell them the opportunity to attempt to persuade me of something, well.... *I also have a fine selection of bridges*.

https://network23.org/stopg8/files/2015/01/anarchistflag.gif
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@alanc ·
$0.06
Interesting article.

Just curious, have you ever met an anarchist in his or her 40s?
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@bacchist ·
$0.03
I have met anarchists well beyond their 40s!
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@anarchyeducation ·
In terms of  philosophy you are absolutely correct:

ANARCHY means no ruler, you do not have any ruler but neither you are your own ruler. on the other hand you should call yourself an AUTARCHIST.

AUTARCHIST means you rule only over yourself.

in practical terms, we, the anarchist use this term because most of the free thinkers identify themselves with anarchy and very few even know the term of AUTARCHISM or they confuse it with AUTOCRACY which is the  complete opposite. however no matter the word you use to identify yourself, you are a free thinker and this makes you a great person who loves freedom.
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@anarchyhasnogods ·
M8 I just made a post about anarchist capitalism not being anarchist check it out you might like it
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@suprepachyderm ·
https://scontent-mia1-2.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/13912689_1212989405429418_6726812874623852388_n.jpg?oh=0ea6b11ba0fa5a1abe17ca2403062609&oe=581A1EE8
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@anarchyhasnogods ·
read the post lmao
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@andu ·
<3
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@ats-david ·
$0.07
A communist complaining about words like "ownership" and "labor" spends his/her own time on his/her own device writing an article to submit to a site where he/she can earn money from other people for that content. 

You've earned nearly $300 by complaining about things that have given you the opportunity to earn that $300 - property and labor. 

Excellent post on the absurdities and contradictions of communist ideology! I hope that was the intent!
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vote details (4)
@lukestokes ·
Hahah.. this made me laugh. Kudos, sir. :)

Oh, wait, did you intend to make me laugh? Did you just make an "attempt by another to dictate my activity"? Did you just initiate "an impingement on my freedom"???

(Sorry @bacchist, just having a little fun at your expense).
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vote details (2)
@ats-david ·
I actually believe that communists are funny people. They exist to entertain us. That's probably why so many actors and comedians are commies.

Now, philosophy and economics? They're not so good at that. Even still, when they try talking about those subjects, it's quite entertaining. I *always* laugh at them.
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@bitbutter · (edited)
$0.03
> No, I do not "own myself." It is not possible for myself or any other person or entity to "own" me, because I am not a piece of property. 

I think we disagree. For clarity the claim I'd make is: You own your body. In that sentence the 'You' refers to what I loosely call the animating intelligence, that's whatever component or system, in a human, that exhibits intentionality - that's the thing that can be a property owner. The brain has a much closer relationship to 'You' than does your little finger. Though both are parts of your body, and are (I claim) owned by 'You'.

'Your body' includes the physical substrate that 'You' (the animating intelligence) emerges from.

And 'Own' means that you have the exclusive right to determine how the physical stuff that makes up your body may be used. For instance, you (and you alone) have the right to decide who else - if anyone - gets to use your spleen, and how.
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@bacchist ·
Yes, we disagree.
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@bitbutter ·
Can you be more specific about where the disagreement is? What claim in my comment do you contest?
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@demotruk · (edited)
Property is just a thing that belongs to someone. It implies rights, that others cannot violate.

Do you agree that that we are material things? We are, by the definitions of those words. Do you agree that we have the rights implied by the word "property" (to use it as you see fit, and that others generally do not have the right to seize or damage your property, and this applies to yourself as well)?

I personally am unconcerned if the word seems 'dehumanising' as long as the meaning fits and it is practically useful and true to see ourselves as our own property.
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@bacchist ·
It's not useful to consider ourselves property. The only value it has is in creating a category of thing which it is possible to use as the basis for violence. I will agree that nobody has the right to seize or damage me, but when you use that to create an abstraction and arbitrarily apply it to external objects, that is when we have a problem. There is no point in creating this abstraction except to justify coercive force.
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@demotruk · (edited)
Since you did not contradict the definitions, can I take it then that if someone were to give you one single useful application of viewing ourselves as property (other than for the purpose of coercion), that you would change your mind?
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@ozertayiz · (edited)
If someone else violates your body, do you feel justified defending yourself with violence, if necessary?

If someone breaks into your home and steals your TV and computer and Iphone, do you feel justified using violence against them, to defend your property? 

If you do, tell me again, how is this different than, owning your body, house and stuff in it, as private property? 

When exactly do you think property rights become "justification of coercive force"?
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@ozertayiz ·
"when you use that to create an abstraction and arbitrarily apply it to external objects, that is when we have a problem"
Property rights are not arbitrary. There are things like, homestading principle, trade, inheritance etc...
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@johnnyhurley ·
To own something is to take responsibility for it. You take responsibility for your actions which your body, which is a material thing,  caused to happen, by the decisions made in your head, upon contemplation of your thoughts and feelings, yes? If you take responsibility for all of that then in essence you own it.
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@kennyskitchen ·
Hi @bacchist :-) Just wanted to let you know that my new post "The 40 anarchists you want to follow on Steemit!" is up, and you're on the list :-) You can find it [here](https://steemit.com/anarchy/@kennyskitchen/the-40-anarchists-you-want-to-be-following-on-steemit)
👍  ,
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vote details (2)
@orly ·
$0.09
Well said. And now for the real question:
How do we implement this gobally, given the current state of society?

Do we buy an island and expand from there?
Can the system be changed by education and bottom-up revolution?
Do we play by the rules and destroy it from within?
👍  , ,
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@bacchist ·
$0.06
>Can the system be changed by education and bottom-up revolution?

I think this is the only way that is compatible with anarchism.
👍  
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@limitless ·
Agreed. That's the solution that I'm trying to implement. Currently, my team is building SteemIQ, which initially is a simple and imperfect tool to predict the quality of posts, but the future implications are much greater: https://steemit.com/development/@nphacker/steemiq-me-how-smart-is-your-writing-find-out-your-steemiq

If we can incentivize people to free themselves from public education through a bottom up approach, we can actually make this happen. There are a lot of problems that distract us about Statism, but I would say education is the root of many of the other problems. If you can free yourself from state indoctrinated schooling and state approved certification, you can completely free your mind and free yourself from the state. This requires a massive grassroots educational overhaul blockchain style.
👍  
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@orly ·
Well, certainly one can not force it onto people. But I believe all of the above have some merit to them.

By leaving society and starting over (say on an island), while you certainly have to deal with the external environment, you are not under direct control of any state. It sets an example people can look at, and compare to their current ways and whoever wants to join is welcome to do so. Eventually, it could take over the world.

If you play by the rules to gain support that is deemed legitimate by the existing system, you can also implement changes in small increments. For example, you could switch from representative democracy to direct democracy. It would encourage people to think for themselves, teach them that they are in control of their own lives and anyone could step up to bring about the change they want to see. You could then move from compulsory taxes to voluntary support of worthy initiatives. And so on. Eventually, people would realize there's no need for state.
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@ozertayiz ·
No, anarcho communism cannot be applied, except for one big communist government owning and controlling everything.

If you "bought an island" or some other land, you agree that land can be owned as property. Also to earn that money, you need to work and sell your products and services, meaning you agree that your labor has market value. 

Anarcho-communism is a totally self-conflicting ideology that cannot possibly be applied and achieve anything good.

See:
https://mises.org/library/death-wish-anarcho-communists
👍  ,
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@orly · (edited)
> No, anarcho communism cannot be applied, except for one big communist government owning and controlling everything.

I have to disagree. Not only can it be applied, but I believe it be a more sustainable, efficient and free form of anarchy than capitalism. If you are interested in my reasoning, see my [comment here](https://steemit.com/anarchy/@dwinblood/so-i-encountered-an-anarcho-communist-and-this-is-my-discussion-debate-invitation#@orly/re-dwinblood-so-i-encountered-an-anarcho-communist-and-this-is-my-discussion-debate-invitation-20160807t042638422z) (I don't want to repeat myself).

> If you "bought an island" or some other land, you agree that land can be owned as property. Also to earn that money, you need to work and sell your products and services, meaning you agree that your labor has market value.

I don't agree with either proposition, but as with any ideology, you have to start somewhere. Otherwise, the system will use force to oppress your ideas. I don't think any anarchist pays taxes or submits to the force of the state to some degree because they believe it's the ideal thing to do, but because not doing so would simply be foolish and counter-productive given the state of things.
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@ozertayiz ·
Another ancom self-conflicting confused person.

Go be autonomous in a cave somewhere, without trading or interacting with anyone. Because even when you are posting here, you are conflicting with yourself. 

You own your body as well as you own your labor. You made your labor  of posting this article a capitalistic commodity to trade. In a Capitalistic free market of content and ideas.  And congrats, you got 62 votes and $28 paid to you for your labor in this marketplace. That's the value of your post and your labor. And no one have forced you for it. There is no violence or threat involved. :D
👍  , , , , ,
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@bacchist ·
What is it that I'm confused about?

Trading is highly overrated.

I didn't produce any commodity. I produced nothing for exchange on the market. I wrote some stuff down in a blockchain, which is now a common good. Nobody has paid for it, and all are free to enjoy it.
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@ozertayiz ·
You produced a commodity we call content. Steem is a free market of content and ideas. The action of writing that words is your labor. Sorry to break the news to you, but the $300 you got paid, someone paid it. You could as well publish the same words in a non-monetized blog, and putting it in public domain, but you chose to put it here, in a capitalistic free market, and you got paid for it. 

And now you are the owner of $300 worth of steem.

(And well done, by the way, I have yet to make $300 with one post. More like +0.30)

Just don't claim you are against private property or trade or anything.
👍  ,
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vote details (2)
@sethlinson ·
$0.03
I think you're just arguing semantics. While I agree that the meaning of words is important and their misuse can lead to dangerous ideas, I don't think this is the most important fight to be had.
👍  
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@bacchist ·
It's quite important, because if ownership of external objects can be considered an extension of this idea of "self-ownership" (which seems to exist only to justify the idea of private property) then it can be used as the justification for violence framed as "self-defense."
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@ozertayiz ·
How do you live without private property? Do you own a house? A computer or smart phone? Clothes? Tools? Or do you live in a cave like a cavemen? Even cavemen had property, the tools made from wood and stone, the food they gathered or hunted, and the cave they lived in...

How do you live without any property?
👍  
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@sethlinson ·
Ah I understand what you're saying more clearly now. I'll have to think about that.
👍  
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@somethingsea ·
This is a reply to @ats-david, because @lukestokes is not a body, not a piece of property, and so I can refer to anyone, such as @demotruk, because @bacchist will not be marketed. Since @ats-david will not claim that which it is not possible to claim without a what (a body), his - pardone - @demotruk... since [who] will not claim [who] steemit money, the $187.36+ via the extension into the future of marketable votes shall be absorbed back into the steemit system, by which the entity, steemit, shall continue physical existence by means of digital and electronic inhabitation across various computers and databases.

I accept @demotruk [who] [who] who (who)'s lack of acceptance of his - pardone - [who's] physical body, being inseperable from [], such that conversation is rendered utterly impossible, and yet there are these *fine selection of bridges*, which [] must also reject per the rejection of a marketable body of physical or mental substance such that marketability can occur.

Oh wait. You are your autonomy?

I accept autonomy's ... rejection of having a... what.... 

Fuck this.

You made me do all this labor after you did all that labor writing that shit... oh, right, right: "activity". You made me do this activity after you did that activity...

Your brain must explode on a daily basis from all that goddamn activity.

You should remove your post so that your activity is not used for marketing as it currently is... to the tune of $187.36.

This site is a coercive capitalist place, per your definitions. Why are you still here? You are being exploited, and soon you'll have exploited enough to exploit others by giving them money in exchange for things like food and water.

You prick!, he said lovingly...
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@bacchist ·
I guess it's always 5 o'clock somewhere...
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@stevenlytle ·
I sort of agree with this. Property one owns can be sold. People can't sell themselves, because they can never give up their own autonomy. They can receive money for agreeing to do what someone else says, but that's not a sale.
👍  
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@suprepachyderm ·
$0.03
Capitalism is not a "mode of production". Capitalism is a means of disseminating production that does occur on a voluntary basis.

Labor is work,  work is "activity involving mental or physical effort done in order to achieve a purpose or result."  

Way to make a distinction without a difference.

"It is true that under the wages system, the individual is not free to choose permanent unemployment. But no other imaginable social system could grant him a right to unlimited leisure; that man cannot avoid submitting to the disutility of labor (work) is not an outgrowth of any social institution. It is an inescapable natural condition of human life and conduct"
Ludwig Von Mises
👍  , , , ,
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vote details (5)
@ultramari0 ·
Strippers are the perfect example of the fact that each person is their own currency. The fact that people throw money at women who behave seductively is a perfect example of being your own Labor.
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properties (23)
authorultramari0
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vote details (3)