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Your flags matter. by berniesanders

View this thread on: hive.blogpeakd.comecency.com
· @berniesanders · (edited)
$4.47
Your flags matter.
<html>
<p>I know many of you feel like your flags don't matter, but, <strong>they do</strong>. &nbsp;Even if they're not removing rewards from a post you feel is undeserving, it sends a message that you don't support what the author is earning.</p>
<p>Use your flags. &nbsp;</p>
<p>Don't stand for the bullshit that's running rampant on Steemit.</p>
<p>Stand up for what you believe in.</p>
</html>
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vote details (109)
@ameliabartlett ·
I'm new to Steemit and don't quite know how flags work. Do I only get so many (the way you only have so many 100% comments)? Does the person who I flag see that I flagged them, and then can retaliate? 

I see plenty of posts that either look stolen (or DEFINITELY are), are otherwise crap, or are negative/not serving the community. But, should I do anything? I'm so new, I don't want to risk my reputation score and be deemed an asshole just because I want to see good content here. 🤷🏻‍♀️ What's a girl to do?
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@annabellenoelle ·
$1.74
Been there. Done that. And got a huge flag from the person i flagged.
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vote details (10)
@artopium · (edited)
$0.33
I agree. I don't think flags are a very good system anyway. In psychology this is referred to as positive/negative reinforcement conditioning. Of the four kinds of conditioning (positive/positive, positive/negative, negative/negative, negative/positive) positive / negative is the least effective. In this case the first part refers to whether the conditioning is being given or taken away. The second part is the type of conditioning. 

## For example: 
* positive (*giving a*) / positive (*reward*), <-- Proven to be the best form of psychological reinforcement. This is what upvoting does.

* negative (*taking away*) / positive (*reward*) <-- Reward money disappears when flagged. This is somewhat more effective than:

* positive (giving a) / negative (punishment) <-- Receiving a punishment is the worst form of psychological conditioning and is usually ineffective. This is why so many dog owners have bad behaving dogs. They believe that positive/negative (giving a punishment includes hitting, yelling, scolding, etc.) is effective when it clearly is not.

* negative (taking away) / negative (a punishment) <-- This is a type of conditioning not used by Steemit in which a negative thing is removed which is in itself a reward, such as the removal of a limitation or prior punishment.
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vote details (2)
@idikuci ·
That's the problem, you need to expect people to retaliate. You're taking money away from them, which in their mind the earned even if they are arseholes. 

Bernie is powerful enough that he doesn't really need to worry about who he flags he can protect himself in a war. Us little guys, need to pick battles that are more competitive.
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@justinashby ·
It takes guts. Good on you for doing it.
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@studgriffin ·
Warning  : Your rep will shoot down 20+ points if you ever flag or disagree with berniesanders
👍  
👎  
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vote details (2)
@arrjey ·
what if we get flagged in return??
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@bachone ·
$0.22
Problem is when flagging a whale, it wont make a positive difference, the whale will most likely flag everything on  yourself ehich will hurt alot, I dont think your intentions are to give all of us (your followers) bad reputation and downvotes.

Surely flags are good to use at inappropiate content from smaller accounts, I support that.
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vote details (3)
@bitfiend ·
While I appreciate your encouragement, I can't imagine that my $500 account stands a chance against the swam that will follow.  Can't say I want my rep to go to (-18) within my first 60 days on the platform.  Who will back me up if it does? You?

I am not sure if me flagging the false prophet will effectively do anything.  What we need is strength in numbers.  I'm talking 5,000 downvotes.  but 5,000 accounts are goin to get swamed with 15,000 pissed off followers.

So help me help you by well, helping me.   I am not sure what kind of help I'm presently asking for.  

*I just know I can't do it alone*

Per steem.supply this guy is taking 41 grand home this week.  He's making over 100 g a month, *easily* from this platform.  Why is this okay?  

While I am a little jealous, what has me annoyed is *everyones* rewards being affected.  

What do *I* do?  What do *we* do?
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@ceepee ·
$0.30
A whole lot of bullshit earning on steemit. Should these undeserving payout continue? Besides when you flag, they come back flaging you continiously with the same sp that got them the earning. So you end up loosing.
👍  
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vote details (1)
@christinb ·
Wow good advice
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👎  
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vote details (2)
@codemojo ·
I've been thinking of writing a bot that would upvote only people with good PageRank score. This algorithm simulates "flow" in a directed graph and so accounts with a lot of fake followers would have a low rank.
👍  
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vote details (1)
@j3dy ·
there are a few accounts that follow everyone and there a few good bots as well, there is one that supports good comments based on some algorithm, buuut that's about it the majority of bots are money laundering and pumping up their respective projects
👍  
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@codemojo ·
I've been thinking of writing a bot that would upvote only people with good PageRank score. This algorithm simulates "flow" in a directed graph and so accounts with a lot of fake followers would have a low rank.
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@creatovert ·
$0.07
@berniesanders sir. Since you're running as a witness now... What do you think of the idea of anonymous flags? 
I know this is a decentralized platform and everything should be transparent on the blockchain or whatever... But can we make the flags visible to witnesses only?
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vote details (2)
@geneeverett ·
Respectfully Horrible idea. That would lead to the end of Steemit.
👍  
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vote details (1)
@creatovert ·
yeah a few witnesses said the same in minnowsupport channel... But didn't explain why :D Explain please
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@danielwong ·
Can we even take him down @berniesanders?

Feels like we're losing this battle. It's so frustrating.
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@j3dy ·
why are you fighting, what have you done, why does this matter, how does this benefit you or the people around you? what have you learned from this? how will this make you better, it's a pointless game from my perspective, if you want to fight, fight, but you better learn some moves first and sadly there are many more players on the other side, all with white teeth and glittering, while half of the people on your side are sitting scared asking questions :D 

seriously think about what you are doing and what it brings, if haejin had consciousness he wouldn't be doing what he is and on top of that even gloat, well I would be all for whales downvoting and wasting their SP since that leaves more for the rest of us :)  so far the fairest time for the platform was when @abit and @snowflake were running a whales no vote experiment, of course it wasn't pretty. 

Well I'm just saying frustration isn't the best driver, I just got myself banned from utopian for saying the mod is crap and he was, it's not my problem he can't have a reason better than "what i just said i did" and "I'm a mod" 

 so better than chasing people with no brains trying to maximize their profits, why not just don't bother with being led to a wall and go on your own way where you are actually doing something productive? 
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@distantsignal ·
$0.17
I agree.  I've flagged dozens of posts of people who were pirating film and TV on DTube.  I never received a retaliatory flag.  If Steem is going to be worth something, flagging has to be used to curb bad actors.
👍  ,
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vote details (2)
@j3dy ·
that is a hard road to walk tho, flagging is just there to disincentivise , it doesn't affect the author much apart from rewards, if someone wants to upload and spam, :| nothing can be done, well banns and hacks, but that's another story. 

I'm still not sure pirating is bad, plagerism on the other hand ... I don't think the mainstream labels are fair in their monopolising of the content but the authors are to blame there since they gave up their rights for fame.

I've flagged a few times mostly all because of disagreement on rewards and a few times when the june july spammers appeared, welcoming **me** to steem :D 

this is a problem out of my reach tho, it's a inherent flaw of the system and human beings in general, since humans are running it even a good machine will break down :D 
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@distantsignal · (edited)
$0.13
I understand that the problem feels too big to do anything about and I don't mind people sharing the occasional film and TV episodes as long as the payout is declined.  However, when people begin uploading in mass to try and turn themselves into some sort of Steem TV channel / studio - with content that isn't theirs - is one place I draw the line.  I've seen several accounts like this.

Not only are these accounts profiting off of someone else's work, they're masquerading as a legitimate, distribution or production channel.  They are neither and their objectives of "sharing" and "providing entertainment" to you is are served under an umbrella of lies and I can't stand for it.  That's fraud.  

On top of the dishonesty, people like me who struggle to create original content get drowned out by those who have literally invested nothing by leveraging tens of thousands of unearned works and wealth.

Shaping the behavior of others on Steemit is what the flags are for because it affects your payout AND reputation.  If people aren't willing to stand up and defend the platform against people like this the platform is going to fail.

Also, as a slight aside, using the Steem blockchain to distribute copy-written material paints a target on the backs of whomever uploads AND downloads.  

It's all on the blockchain and people should avoid incriminating themselves.
👍  
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vote details (1)
@draffanahmed · (edited)
Well flag people who are spamming and abusing steemit. But still we shouldn’t make it personal because then uses  can abuse this and will start flagging other people they don’t like.
👍  
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vote details (1)
@drpuffnstuff ·
Man it just sucks to not have a whole lot of steem and wasting voting power not helping and encouraging a good post, but downvoting a crap post that doesnt deserve what it has.. I want to use my power helping good authors.. Once I downvote I am usually on damage control for weeks trying to not get downvoted back.. No easy way
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@firsawan ·
Exactly, I dont know what you're talking about. I am just resteem.
👍  
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vote details (1)
@garudi · (edited)
$1.34
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vote details (9)
@j3dy ·
yup truly a sad state of affairs, I've seen it time and time again, although this is by far the biggest wave, so far bernie was the biggest flagger around here, although dan did flag bernie into oblivion as well :D lucky for bernie he has a few clones of himself ;)  
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@gary-wood ·
Never keep your your freak flag in the closet, let it loose
properties (22)
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@gduran ·
What are the reasons for flagging? Shitty content, plagiarism, over valued post, self upvoting via bots, of these the shitty content and overvalued parts are not good reasons what may seem shitty to you might seem great to others, plagiarism- steemcleaners and cheetah are on that even screwing posts that aren't plagiarism, self upvoting comments I think is wrong upvoting your own article is OK I think sometimes that is the only vote I get. All in all I don't think flagging has any real benefit except that the flagger loses that down vote when he could have upvoted an article he thinks is great or maybe a lot of articles depending on his VP.
Of course we also have the vendetta, but that one is for personal reasons so I can't opine about that.
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@gothika47 · (edited)
What if I flag some one basically bot farming shit posts and he starts flagging my legit posts as a revenge? What about the comments that get spammed like WOW GREAT POST THX FOR SHARING? Should we start flagging those?
👍  
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vote details (1)
@berniesanders ·
Well, revenge flagging happens, I've done it myself because they are annoying.  I'm not going to advise on **what** you should flag, just suggesting that you should if you're not already.
👍  , , , , , , , , , , , ,
👎  
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vote details (14)
@hadji ·
Affirmative! Though I am of the opinion that there should be a caste system in flagging. Let minnows monitor minnows, dolphins to dolphins/minnows and whales to whales/dolphins/minnows.
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@haejinfans ·
https://media.giphy.com/media/xT77XWum9yH7zNkFW0/giphy.gif
👎  , , , , , , , , , , , ,
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vote details (13)
@haejinfans ·
you making shit posts of no use to community and still flagging others
👎  , , , , , , , , , , , ,
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vote details (13)
@heajin · (edited)
@haejinfans a message for you: We all said fuck you bitch and kept going.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A5TsjmaycsQ
👍  
👎  
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vote details (2)
@haejinfans · (edited)
$0.17
@berniesanders proved that he is a bitchy bastard as he flaged my post even after saying so much:P lol... he is a real ass. 
See he gonna flag this comment too soon.. common you fucking ass... flag me
👍  
👎  ,
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vote details (3)
@hatemmkh ·
that's true and I count it a positive action either by removing rewards and keep the community clean or by encouraging the author to improve the content quality and that also will keep it clean
properties (22)
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@idikuci ·
$0.13
Bernie, 

You're like the king of flags, you know what you're doing and you're trying to help steemit which is good. I think if you have the time, it would be really good if you created a "how to" guide to flagging. I don't mean 
1. press flag 
2. then press ok

I mean actually: these are behaviors to flag.
*
*
*

And some sort of a minnow support to allow us little guys to get a hold of you if our cause is just, so that we don't get killed by some arsehole...

Just a thought.

Ok, I changed my mind, this guy is king of flags: 
http://img.xcitefun.net/users/2009/09/117613,xcitefun-flag-man-.jpg

So let's say your more like emperor of flags.

[Flag King](http://img.xcitefun.net/users/2009/09/117613,xcitefun-flag-man-.jpg)
👍  
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vote details (1)
@joe.public ·
Hey @berniesanders The reasons it has become so unpopular is obvious.
Now is the time to clean house and make sure that the people who are being flagged are being flagged for the right reason.
Yes there are some very valid reasons for flagging, plagiarism being a huge one. 
But that is not what people are being asked to flag many times. Flagging without any consensus and open discussion seems to be doomed from the beginning on a platform like this
properties (22)
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@shello ·
$0.05
Hey it's  @joe.public! 

After finding out about everyone getting conned out of rewards, I may actually need that hug now. I'm flagging him. My reason is clear. @haejin does not care about Steemit or anyone else, even when that's where his earnings are coming from. We don't need people ruining things for others. After researching this myself I can safely say that this case is no longer in the gray area for me. At this point I am beginning to understand that the rep number next to our names is **laregly cosmetic.** 

I know that I am no lesser of a person, EVEN IF someone ever decides to flag my rep down. If I lose my rewards then it has a second chance to make it to a good post. 

I'd like to imagine that you would still read my blogs even if I had zero rep, and THAT is what matters to me.

# If we really want to see Steemit succeed, then we have to be willing to flag others down. No matter how powerful they may be when their goal is to harm others. DON'T BE AFRAID TO FLAG, you are helping the rewards pool and every single user on Steemit.
👍  
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vote details (1)
@joe.public · (edited)
$0.02
'After finding out about everyone getting conned out of rewards, I may actually need that hug now'

who has been conned out of rewards and who conned them?  

SOME flagging is necessary most flag attacks have all the integrity and validity of a witch hunt. As for helping every single user on Steemit .......I call bullshit on that. It help Whales like Bernie RAPE the reward pool with his many many accounts and reward pool mining bots. And he enriches himself with your down vote. YES he has MILLIONS of Steem but he wants YOU to use YOUR SteemPower to enrich him.
He also has a long history of abusing and threatening people for no valid reason. Why do you think he has a -18 rep? because he is so wise? get real   

 @haejin is not a generous person and he self votes a lot. 
But please tell me what bad thing will happen from him making a lot of money?
👍  
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vote details (1)
@joe.public ·
$0.02
I should let you know that I would still read your work and vote for it if you had a rep of -19
because i have looked at your work and account behavior. And we need more high integrity people like yourself on the platform. 
I don't need to agree with you on every issue because i have a sense of how you are as a person and i know you want to protect the platform. And that is what i am interested in as well. 

So please explain to me what harm he is doing to the platform by making lots of money.
👍  
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vote details (1)
@kryptik ·
$0.94
You know what? 

I get flagged everyday. Even though the little piss-ant who does it annoys the shit out of me, I respect him for doing what he believes is right. 

**Even though he’s wrong.**

*I had to get the last word lol.*
👍  , , ,
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vote details (4)
@apsu ·
You seem to be forgetting, he pointed our very strongly that he is against flagging and it is communist censorship.
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@gothika47 ·
That's my problem as I said in my comment. If I start flagging people posting shit content or comments what will stop them from flagging my good posts I actually spend time making?
👍  
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vote details (1)
@geneeverett ·
Nothing at all. In fact it appears we should expect that from the feedback...
👍  ,
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vote details (2)
@swelker101 ·
Don't forget that the guy in question is gutless and doesn't post or comment with that account.
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@j3dy ·
why would he he could lose reputation then :D the system here is flawed, you can spam wallets and scam people, no problem nothing to be done, you can abuse funds and buy in the pot, you can buy other people off with votes, truly a great capitalist place, luckily not everyone has that mentality so this happens rarely, but it never seems to go away as well ... 
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@marshel ·
Good post fowllo and vote I'm
👎  ,
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vote details (2)
@moon32walker ·
$0.13
I'm flagging a big author every day for one reason, reward disagreement. That got me absolutely nothing and he retaliated by flagging several of my posts to 0. So if you say stand up for what you believe in, that's not the whole picture. You should of said stand up for what you believe in and risk getting fucked in the process.
👍  , ,
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vote details (3)
@j3dy ·
well if you disagree with some pumped up ego you are the enemy :) 
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@namchau ·
Heard lots of experience from people on the flag.
properties (22)
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@namra ·
When begin a war, you need only tree things: Gold, Gold and Gold. (Napoleon),  To buy, weapons, to buy technology, to buy people.

![](https://steemitimages.com/DQmdpDNvMQfojx8CmMspTqAPCBrHajjKmYEU5v1pN3XG1gA/image.png)
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@nsbachurin ·
Out of thy mouth into God's ears
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@playfulfoodie ·
$0.04
I use my flags, but mostly for plagiarism. The thing is, if we flag big accounts, we risk retaliation which can quickly bring us down to 0 rep. For me, that means self-preservation kicks in. I've worked really hard on my account and reputation and I would be devastated to have it brought down to 0. At this moment, Steemit is the only place I earn any money, so inciting the wrath of a whale would have serious consequences for my life. My life isn't secure enough to be able to handle that.

I completely agree with so much that you are doing here, but for the most part, the most I dare to do is boycot these people. I think many Steemians share these sentiments. Flagging big accounts is just too risky for the smaller users. It's a very sad thing, but that's how it is right now...
👍  
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vote details (1)
@geneeverett ·
$0.02
I agree with you 100% 
It’s not worth the retaliation
👍  
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vote details (1)
@j3dy ·
I agree with you completely and like everything whenever there is a problem it hits the good people first, this is a whale sized problem and while we can all do something if we disagree with the current state of affairs we can get a lot of hate, there is a argument about privacy that kicks in, but as it is probably privacy here won't fly well at all, it would be good to have some understanding between people, but it's normal whales are unreasonable, I bet most of them either don't care about the fact or don't want to get into this for the same reasons, well to protect their investment or whatever or not to mess up their good standing.

I don't see why everyone should be concerned with the problems I've done it for quite a while and I can't say it was helpful for me, well so far I haven't been flagged and I've been hanging out on the battlefields trying to talk some sense into people, buuuut that's neither here nor there, I don't seem to have done too well and people are almost impossible to change from the outside, if they don't want to understand what they are doing is wrong and they are being unreasonable, well you have haejin as a prime example, he doesn't care, he's a successful blogger/author and you better celebrate his accomplishments :D everyone else doesn't deserve that part of the pool it's for our new celebrity :D 
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@shello ·
$0.06
Heya @playfulfoodie,

I can see that this is a legitimate reason to not flag but, **rep and rewards won't matter at all if Steemit fails.** It is also understandable to feel that retaliation flagging could harm our own hard work. 

<h3>Their flags may remove my rewards, but it will not make my blogs any less meaningful. I would imagine that there is actually enough power to wipe out almost **ANY** post, if everyone works together to spread the awareness. If we can stop things like this now, there will be far more rewards for everyone in the future. </h3>

I am in a slightly different situation than you are, I am a student and have a day job on top of being on Steemit. My bills still get paid even if I make nothing blogging, and it is liberating to know that I am here because I want to be around to see Steemit flourish.

My suggestions to others would be, 

* If you have income outside of Steemit, you can afford to flag and help everyone. 

* If your only income is from Steemit, take some time out to write posts that will help reach those who can flag. 

Unless we can move together to resolve problems and overcome hurdles, we are only a community in name. Depending on our own choices and our voices, we choose if everyone wins or loses. Please don't forget that.

With love,
@shello
👍  
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vote details (1)
@playfulfoodie ·
$0.03
I love your reply @shello and you make very good points! I'm sticking to flagging plagiarists for now, since they usually can't harm me too much. They retaliate from time to time, but they aren't big whales, so that's okay. Besides that, I will keep boycotting the big earners that I feel are undeserved, like the post spammers and simple vacation pictures of cute girls.

I've written some Steemit related posts before about problems and/or solutions I see for Steemit. The problem there is that they don't really reach the eyes they are meant to. They just reach other frustrated Steemians. I'll throw one in now and then, but I don't want to look like I'm milking the steemit tag either :-)
👍  
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vote details (1)
@ponts ·
I wish more people used flags for the reason you suggest. But I see that a lot of the flagging is done by butt hurt little bitches getting emotional about what is said because it goes against their belief system.
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@rubeldas ·
well post in steemit thanks  for shearing
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@sco ·
$0.40
Problem is that I am fucking afraid of being flagged back. For a minnow like me, a flag from a whale can end the steemit carreer for good.
👍  , , , , , , , , , , , , ,
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vote details (14)
@spectrumecons ·
I have yet to use my flags. This does not mean I won't in the future. There is a lot of bad content going around. 

At the moment, I feel it is better to focus on the positives. 

It looks like people are using flags to bully other people, that should not be tolerated.
properties (22)
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@steemernoob ·
$0.04
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i did what i can but im just a small fish
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vote details (1)
@suchi ·
good job. i like your post and following.
👍  
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vote details (1)
@themarkymark ·
$1.62
![](https://steemitimages.com/DQmbYjVrk4Rk8gfimMh3u1DJF5D9BiaRUXkhqLAt9u7N2PG/image.png)

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vote details (63)
@berniesanders ·
You got a free vote for commenting on my post!
👍  
👎  
properties (23)
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vote details (2)
@whatsup · (edited)
$0.89
While I agree wholeheartedly with this message...

Sadly, we have had a whale that flags sometimes for questionable reasons.  He also doubles down on those threats and carries the flagging on for days, and extends the flagging to others who try to share their point of view on the topic or defend the "Flagged User".  

He pounds his chest while reinforcing over and over that if your account is smaller than his he has every right to flag, punish and insult the users of the platform.

Hence we have a culture where people are afraid to make a statement and others are hesitant to defend what they think is right.

With much power comes much responsibility.
👍  , , , ,
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vote details (5)
@berniesanders ·
If you've got something to say, say it like a man.  I won't stand for your passive-aggressive bullshit.
👍  , , , , , , , , , , , ,
👎  
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vote details (14)
@whatsup · (edited)
$2.51
Okay, you have contributed to the culture in a major way, and your post seems disingenuous and ironic.
👍  
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vote details (1)