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Hardfork Update - Curation being added back to comment rewards, revised curation and reward curves for both posts and comments by timcliff

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hardfork · @timcliff · (edited)
$79.02
Hardfork Update - Curation being added back to comment rewards, revised curation and reward curves for both posts and comments
One of the proposed changes in HF 17 was to split comments and posts into separate reward pools, and remove curation rewards from comments. Many users and witnesses in the community expressed concern over this change. Based on the feedback from the community, the Steemit dev team has decided to make some changes.

Most notably: 
- There **will** be curation rewards for **both** comments and posts.
- A revised reward curve for **both** comment and post reward pools
- A revised curation formula for **both** comment and post reward pools

Here is the comment from GitHub:
![](https://steemitimages.com/DQmVjwHtxsqqAsB92ZJ6T5WdEdjn9oZbVhE4xSJrWgcYKoo/image.png)
(<a href="https://github.com/steemit/steem/issues/774#issuecomment-282416981">GitHub link</a>)

Great job to everyone in the community who has been discussing and advocating for changes. Most notably @ats-david, @smooth, @clayop, @pfunk, @snowflake, @abit, @jesta, @liberosist, and @sigmajin. (Sorry to those I missed - I know there were many more - but these are the ones fresh in my mind.)

Also, a **HUGE** thank you should go out to the Steemit dev team. I hear complaints from a lot of people that Steemit doesn't listen to the community regarding the changes they, but from what I see - they listen and adapt to what the community is pushing for time and time again. It is very difficult to get consensus from the entire community on _any_ significant change, but I do see them doing their best trying to balance out many competing wants/needs/interests to achieve the best set of changes to improve the platform for everyone.

I for one am now very excited for the upcoming hardfork, as well as the many other exciting changes soon to come!
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vote details (320)
@abit · (edited)
$0.16
Related info: the curve is explained here: https://steemit.com/steem/@clayop/brief-explanation-and-discussion-about-new-reward-system

Thanks for bringing these discussions up.

//Edit: self-upvoted for visibility.
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@asmolokalo · (edited)
$0.07
...
👍  
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vote details (1)
@acidyo · (edited)
FYI readers, this interview happened pre-hf16.
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@asmolokalo · 
Tru e. 103 weeks for power down.jajks :)
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@ats-david · 
So they're still splitting the pools? Why? Any particular reason?
👍  ,
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vote details (2)
@l0k1 · 
I support the partitioning of the rewards pool because I think that really comments are a separate type of voting system, and when the two have been together, comments have been nearly completely unimportant for rewards. With a fixed partition there is a more clear incentive to engage with comments.
👍  
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vote details (1)
@smooth · (edited)
$7.91
Maybe the arbitrary allocation to comments will be too low?

I think we should make one significant rule change at a time, in order to be able to see what that change actually does, and the flattening of the reward curve is perhaps the most significant change that has ever been made in terms of the social platform (HF16 was arguably at least as significant on the token/investment side).

Let's let the new flatter curve play out, which will with virtual certainty result in a greatly increased share of rewards going to comments, see what things look like once the economy has adjusted to it, and then reevaluate the need for (and the rules governing) a separate comment pool.
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vote details (5)
@sneak · (edited)
$0.31
About 10x more people comment than post. About 10x more people vote than comment.

It's easier for a user (especially a brand new user) to write some snarky one liner comment on something they read than to compose a new, multi-line post in a blank window. We think that rewarding this kind of "drive-by" participation more is a valuable improvement to increase engagement and retention, and to generally incentivize more content and sharing of opinion (which offers more value to readers in turn).

Also, comment threads are fun.

(I was one for a 50/50 split, personally. Comments make the site.)
👍  ,
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vote details (2)
@timcliff · 
Yes, they are. I don't have any info beyond what they reported in the GitHub issue. Based on what they said in the issue, it seems like they want to be able to experiment a little bit more with how rewards are allocated and be able to use different formulas and percentages for different things.

![](https://steemitimages.com/DQmR3vyvazZ3tcRaH6eny5MssCb1MVghU9ACeEEAB1W9zht/image.png)
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@automaton · 
Change is good :)
👍  
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vote details (1)
@biophil · 
Good changes. Thumbs up from this guy! :)

BTW, never stop doing these updates. These are so great.
👍  , ,
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@biophil ·
$0.02
Hey, by the way, I just discovered a new likely use for one of the new features in HF17: [paid curation guilds.](https://steemit.com/curation/@biophil/we-re-about-to-get-paid-membership-curation-guilds)
👍  
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@timcliff · 
Indeed :)
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@buzzbeergeek ·
$0.08
Interesting read. Maybe this was a good time to join the community after all!
👍  
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vote details (1)
@decentralizd · 
Whats the end goal here with all these changes?
👍  
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@timcliff · 
To improve the platform by addressing some of the underling issues that have been affecting user retention.
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@dragon40 · 
Useful stuff - thank you.
👍  
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vote details (1)
@freebornangel · 
Thank goodness, I was gonna have to unvote nearly everybody in the top 19 that I vote for,...
👍  ,
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vote details (2)
@guest123 · 
TEST
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@jlufer · 
Thank you very much for the information, your work and dedication to the platform Mr. @timcliff congratulations
👍  ,
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vote details (2)
@timcliff · 
Welcome. Thanks @jlufer :)
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@l0k1 · 
I am pleased that they have adopted the curve that people were crying for and I am glad they are splitting the pool. I don't think this is the last time the pool will be split either, because the voting schemes for proposed use cases has to be separate. 

Now, hopefully a trend change in the price :)
👍  ,
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vote details (2)
@liberosist · 
Thank you for the update and continuously parsing GitHub for us dev-challenged folks! This is great news. There's been a lot of antagonism towards Steemit, Inc. of late. I hope people give them credit where it's due. 

I'm OK with the multiple pools. I can see why going modular can be beneficial for future initiatives. I recall Ned propose short-form reward pools, Disqus-competitor solution etc - they have gotta be considering these. However, I do feel 38% is far too high for the comments pool. We'll see what the stats say, if there's an order of magnitude increase in the quantity and quality of comments, without a decrease in post activity, I'd be happy to be proven wrong.
👍  
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vote details (1)
@smooth · (edited)
$0.02
Modular is fine, that's a coding issue. You can have modular reward pools with only one such module instance existing initially. I feel we are much better off evaluating the change to the reward function (which is likely to  be a very significant change, with far-reaching consequences, some as yet unrecognized) before also making additional changes and significantly muddying the water.

I'm going to go out on a limb and guess there would certainly be an order of magnitude increase in the quantity of comments with the proposed split (ignoring the effect of reward curve). As for quality, well...
👍  , , , ,
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vote details (5)
@sneak · 
Comments that lack quality can simply be flagged. I hear some of y'all are pretty good at that.
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@merej99 · 
I think this is a good thing for the upcoming hardfork, but I'm also an advocate for doing our best to "break" Steemit so we can find the weak spots while we're still in beta. Any of these changes to pay/reward structure really isn't going to affect my participation anyway so maybe I'm crazy. I haven't completely ruled that out. lol  Thanks for the info, Tim
👍  
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vote details (1)
@timcliff · 
> I'm also an advocate for doing our best to "break" Steemit so we can find the weak spots while we're still in beta.

That's an interesting viewpoint! For sure - if it is going to break, now is the time to make it happen :)

> Any of these changes to pay/reward structure really isn't going to affect my participation anyway so maybe I'm crazy.

Hopefully it will make more 'regular' users feel like they at least have _some_ say by increasing the power of their votes compared to the mega-whales :)
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@natureofbeing · 
thanks @timcliff, I appreciate your witness work and how well you translate  these changes
👍  
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vote details (1)
@timcliff · 
Welcome :) Thanks!
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@stellabelle · 
This sounds quite good! I was definitely interested in seeing the revised reward curves! That's exciting. 
Now can you please translate the curve into a graphic so regular people can understand?
I am feeling quite optimistic. This does look like it's moving in a good direction. Thanks for communicating this to us.
👍  
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vote details (1)
@timcliff ·
$7.80
> Now can you please translate the curve into a graphic so regular people can understand?

It's a little bit too much math for me to do on a Friday night ;) Steemit indicated that they would be following up with more details on the reward curve. Unless someone else wants to take a stab at it, we'll probably have to wait for their explanation.
👍  , ,
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vote details (3)
@stellabelle · 
i know, I was being a bit sarcastic! I appreciate your response though. 
I should have spent more time on math, clearly. I was good at math early on, but I got sidetracked by art......
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@stellabelle · 
is it still happening on March 7?
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@stellabelle ·
$0.07
http://i.giphy.com/QpOZPQQ2wbjOM.gif
👍  ,
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vote details (2)
@thecryptofiend ·
$0.03
Good news!

http://www.memegasms.com/media/created/vhyfxm.jpg
👍  , , , ,
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vote details (5)
@acidyo · 
I will never forget that voice.
👍  , , , ,
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vote details (5)
@kingscrown ·
$0.03
yeah i hear it in my head when reading this too!
👍  , ,
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