Three Times The Salary by tarazkp

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hive-167922 · @tarazkp · Nov 30 '23

$28.96

Three Times The Salary

Another Thursday, another interesting client discussion. I should probably make these into a series. In fact, I should probably serialize a few of my topics like I used to do, as having buckets for the information is useful. However, that is not what this article is about this time.

In the session today we were talking about how money gets used and I asked a question that might be interesting to consider, although it would need to be "translated" into the local conditions.

>What do you think the life of someone who earns €10,000 a month looks like?

![image.png](https://files.peakd.com/file/peakd-hive/tarazkp/242DZUcQmqi8nNuP1LFrVTrufzcgURkK6FU3Qyxw43b7GHXeqnEL3ZAaqpWHWKVaxkm22.png)

€10,000 is about 3x the average salary in Finland, so localize it that way to think about how it might apply to you, otherwise it is all irrelevant. When we visualize things, we do so from our own experiences, which means we have to do some translation work. It is probably hard to relate to earning €10,000 a month for someone who lives in a place where that is twice the yearly salary or, for someone who earns 10M a year. What I find is that people compare some of the things I say in relation to their own conditions, without doing the translation, where for example someone will say "I would be happy earning the 3000 a month" because it is a yearly salary where they are, but they have no experience of living life in Finland.

>Do the work.

*Anyway.*

The answer my client gave was exactly what I expected them to do; *stereotype* based on their opinion about what the €10,000 earner would have. For instance, a large, modern house with lake views, a hybrid 4WD or higher model Tesla, and brand name clothing.

This is interesting, because the stereotype isn't necessarily based on the reality, but it is based on the conditioned characterization of the persona, and then what *we would do* if we had that kind of money. However, I brought up an example of a friend from about 18 years ago who was earning €8000 a month (13,000 in today's value), was renting a small apartment, had no car, and by the end of the month needed friends to buy him food until payday. The reason was that in a weekend, he could drink around €2000 worth with his friends, investing nothing. At the time, he was earning almost 5x more than I was a month.

There is this expectation that people who earn well, spend well, but that isn't the case at all, especially those who earn well easily. Making money doesn't automatically mean that someone is good with money, which we see time and time again with sports stars, who go from making tens of thousands or more a week, to being destitute and declaring bankruptcy in the space of a few years after their sporting career ends.

When we think "what we would do" if we earned more money, we make a lot of assumptions that in general, we will use it well, not waste it. For example, I might think that if my salary doubled, I would keep my current lifestyle the same and put the majority of the difference onto the mortgage so that I could knock it out and be debt free in a handful of years, instead of a couple decades. I would then invest the rest into generative vehicles to build up a portfolio, so that in the future, I would be debt free and have a significant income coming in passively.

>What are the chances?

*Slim.*

While I might have the knowledge and hold the ideals, the reality is that I am unlikely to behave as I would *want to behave* once I was in that situation. There is a massive difference between knowing and doing, but there is also a massive difference between thinking we know what it is like to live in certain conditions, and actually *having the experience* of being in those conditions. Most of us are earning near the average, so we don't know what it is like to consistently earn 3x as much, so we don't know how we would actually behave if we did.

It is important to recognize that our judgement of our own behavior is *not as good* as we might think, especially when we are predicting how we are going to act under conditions we have not experienced. The amount of people who say, "If I won the lottery, I would..." should be tempered by all the stories of people who did win the lottery, and then ~~lost~~ *spent* it all.

It is obvious that we have preconceived ideas about others, but we also make assumptions about ourselves, because *we think* that we know ourselves. Yet, we might be the worst judges of character when it comes to our own behaviors, because not only are we overly soft, we also look to protect our ego, to make us feel better about ourselves in our own eyes.

Stereotypes are stereotypes for a reason, but they do change over time, so we have to be careful that the heuristic we are using to make our judgements, is still valid for the moment. And similarly, we have to also come to terms with the fact that we are likely part of that stereotype also, meaning that we will behave predictably according to our conditions. And, there are many factors that go into this, including our cultural programming.

It is *very hard* to significantly change our own behaviors for the better, because it feels "right" to do what we have always done. So, we fall back on our defaults, maintaining a status quo, getting average results. When my client visualized a person earning 3x the average, he was betraying his conditioning, as we all would. Perhaps someone who earned €10,000 a month or more, would have a different answer, and rather than focusing on a house and car, they looked at the work it took to have what they have instead.

>We all have our own perspectives.

There is what *we think* we would do.
And there is what we *actually do.*

*A 3x salary sounds nice.*

Taraz
[ Gen1: Hive ]

</div>

👍 acidyo, vcelier, steemychicken1, galenkp, abh12345, fredrikaa, steemcleaners, smasssh, meesterboom, preparedwombat, indiaunited, stayoutoftherz, behiver, jamesbrown, arcange, holbein81, bitcoinflood, papilloncharity, ericvancewalton, bozz, shanibeer, cryptoandcoffee, sumatranate, borran, bala41288, pishio, dcityrewards, pokerarema, revisesociology, haveyoursay, cst90, bigtom13, mobbs, deathwing, farm-mom, jhelbich, lizelle, hive-186141, sorin.cristescu, netaterra, bobinson, combination, kevinwong, aafeng, becca-mac, fw206, codingdefined, penguinpablo, storiesoferne, dbooster, dandesign86, muterra, nanzo-scoop, soyrosa, moeenali, jfang003, yameen, steemflow, molometer, mciszczon, kendewitt, logic, sbi-booster, emrebeyler, and 405 others

`author`	tarazkp
`permlink`	three-times-the-salary
`category`	hive-167922
`json_metadata`	{"app":"peakd/2023.11.3","format":"markdown","tags":["investing","wealth","finance","mindset","economics","society","health","behavior"],"users":[],"image":["https://files.peakd.com/file/peakd-hive/tarazkp/242DZUcQmqi8nNuP1LFrVTrufzcgURkK6FU3Qyxw43b7GHXeqnEL3ZAaqpWHWKVaxkm22.png"]}
`created`	2023-11-30 10:50:03
`last_update`	2023-11-30 10:50:03
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properties (23)vote details (469)

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lerma	2,862,901,115	50%
gawz69	756,743,209	75%
nakary	2,201,663,625	100%
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cst90	344,300,571,793	100%
rachelssi	14,330,166,834	100%
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cryptictruth	10,794,145,503	2.5%
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smartvote	89,025,965,080	3.7%
jk6276	6,051,022,483	40%
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dlike	33,488,153,760	11%
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voxmortis	37,407,327,531	20%
jokinmenipieleen	3,555,033,019	100%
t1pf	738,194,712	75%
bagpuss	10,070,157,009	100%
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marcocasario	46,302,964,588	7.44%
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oac	2,872,425,521	75%
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therealyme	4,192,082,716	15%
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kat.eli	824,770,152	20%
idea-make-rich	60,041,995,104	100%
jontv	4,189,442,391	100%
iamfarhad	782,298,223	50%
hive-168869	27,047,322,801	100%
dorkpower	4,309,177,739	100%
rdfield	1,983,882,702	100%
officialhisha	44,473,044,354	100%
yogeshbhatt	2,386,041,463	25%
schindmaehre	340,346,014	100%
drax.leo	3,554,261,286	10%
jfang003	172,540,435,282	50%
tamiapt6	1,149,531,224	100%
netaterra.leo	832,101,301	13.5%
hivechat	552,535,827	5.5%
sillybilly	614,977,262	100%
meestemboom	2,114,774,646	100%
godfather.ftw	16,838,810,419	22.5%
blockbroccoli	1,092,599,718	67.5%
scoutroc	41,784,615,698	100%
hykss.leo	22,176,758,425	2.2%
iikrypticsii	32,620,029,093	70%
pokerarema	404,124,366,890	100%
instytutfi	2,262,003,405	100%
meowcurator	2,249,925,728	75%
abh12345.archon	724,798,383	100%
retaliatorr	2,863,819,614	100%
kurkumita	13,084,483,390	75%
draygyn	1,352,692,217	5%
halukshananah	4,500,083,050	100%
drricksanchez	39,215,021,688	7.5%
iviaxpow3r	599,451,412	5%
rendrianarma	1,236,655,100	30%
emstone	4,471,233,604	50%
leveluplifestyle	15,187,686,823	30%
juecoree.stem	708,680,454	100%
jane1289	107,215,571,247	50%
meesterleo	1,690,043,071	100%
muterra	193,444,657,906	25%
stdd	21,756,457,584	36%
okluvmee	12,327,945,757	12.5%
hive.friends	846,494,454	50%
scooter77.pob	1,798,446,627	100%
mattbrown.art	6,778,442,206	75%
disha30	788,603,758	25%
kamaleshwar	3,360,588,254	25%
chandra.shekar	5,364,972,411	25%
kannannv	16,239,480,548	25%
crypto-guides	9,482,895,408	100%
pishio	508,878,306,863	10%
hackersfund	493,955,702	75%
jimah1k	992,487,963	25%
mjvdc	10,546,753,896	100%
mvmoning2021	13,522,267,943	100%
gamerzaza	737,991,996	12.5%
outwars	41,889,637,722	79%
cashheaven	12,745,561,042	100%
trasto	3,300,668,639	30%
iproto	608,266,248	5%
jkp.nisha	4,295,623,854	100%
tarabh	1,449,458,553	100%
ingi1976	1,718,066,157	2.5%
michupa	6,848,395,056	2.5%
talentos	87,386,929,604	50%
deimage	3,986,854,427	12.5%
brandonperez	784,336,322	100%
relf87	23,095,658,289	50%
weone	2,843,041,631	100%
cryptohaytham	1,062,500,236	12.5%
drexlord	3,780,177,073	7.5%
saboin.sports	240,486,159	31.18%
riz611	43,300,729,470	100%
hoffmeister84	1,439,602,422	11%
janitzearratia	14,122,748,401	50%
rafzat	1,410,363,531	4.91%
balaz	10,126,330,821	20%
thorlock	1,038,680,477	5%
bfciv	985,461,702	37.5%
ryosai	1,680,064,654	25%
gerardoguacaran	4,191,389,472	100%
nthtv	128,383,072,569	100%
pero82	4,049,889,041	40%
isabel-vihu	9,739,064,488	75%
kilvnrex	3,912,311,791	30%
mighty-thor	505,116,634	5%
mallorcamum	1,151,340,547	75%
mdasein	2,674,227,051	30%
alg-nftgaming	40,867,438,699	100%
sperosamuel15	9,533,306,002	50%
hive-186141	281,843,690,041	100%
becca-mac	223,759,183,692	100%
cindynancy	525,597,861	12.5%
justbabybee	49,958,090,517	100%
pinkchic	2,900,805,249	3.75%
liseth.zamora	11,979,185,356	100%
celestegray	57,783,270,199	50%
emma-h	86,171,221,487	90%
awildovasquez	27,909,426,654	100%
treefrognada	1,831,741,948	10%
imacryptogeek	16,933,152,729	25%
nurul-uli	3,480,753,089	100%
erang	1,543,060,027	50%
ijelady	582,247,518	12.5%
abhay2695	2,323,253,981	12.5%
gollumkp	2,391,364,481	20%
contapoupanca	1,154,585,231	75%
faniaviera	5,333,189,487	100%
buffalo.leo	0	100%
selftheist	1,703,255,566	50%
mrbonkers	2,622,530,957	50%
happy411	836,135,350	12.5%
biyimi	702,396,724	5%
coinjoe	41,913,998,485	50%
syawalularsya	2,223,778,279	100%
hivedrip	8,047,839,849	5%
emma-h2	120,170,589,383	100%
literal	15,902,004,609	100%
haveyoursay	386,628,389,637	100%
urrirru	40,128,639,700	100%
toluwanispecial	7,850,476,171	100%

@bozz · Nov 30 '23

$0.14

I honestly think the more you make the more you spend.  Even the most disciplined of people fall into this habit.  It might not be that you want to or intend to, but suddenly you can, and that fact has a lot of power.  Either that, or as I have said before, the world has a way of equalizing itself.  For example, many times when people get their tax return back, they suddenly are hit with a large expense they didn't see coming.  In our case, my wife and I got some decent raises this year, only to realize we needed a new car so the increase is offset by the new monthly payment.

👍 tarazkp, elsurtidor

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properties (23)vote details (2)

voter	weight	wgt%	rshares	pct	time
tarazkp	0 B		213,927,560,419	9%
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@tarazkp · Nov 30 '23

$0.02

>I honestly think the more you make the more you spend. Even the most disciplined of people fall into this habit.

I agree. What I *would hope* I would do though is to spend "less" percentage wise, meaning that there is far more left over. 

>Either that, or as I have said before, the world has a way of equalizing itself. 

I feel like the banks sell the data for "whenever someone gets extra cash" and then the companies find ways to capture it.

👍 bozz

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bozz	0 B		48,502,254,061	3%

@bozz · Nov 30 '23

I wouldn't be surprised if that was the case, but there are also the karmic factors at play.  Like a clothes dryer dying probably doesn't matter if a company knows I have more money or not.  Maybe...  Ideally I might spend more, but I am also moving more into investments as well.  It's interesting though how that extra breathing room can slowly diminish and eventually you are back to living paycheck to paycheck.

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1 reply

@crypticat · Dec 2 '23

Is it 10k before or after tax? Before tax means you're struggling to support a family and save in a many places. Even 10k net isn't anything special because of the second biggest impediment to wealth accumulation, inflation.

properties (22)

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@tarazkp · Dec 2 '23

Doesn't matter - apply it to your life, wherever you are.<div><a href="https://engage.hivechain.app">![](https://i.imgur.com/XsrNmcl.png)</a></div>

properties (22)

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@cryptoandcoffee · Nov 30 '23

$0.10

This is actually very true as many would shock you what they do with their money each month.  I know when I was younger I did think differently about money compared to today having many years under the belt. Fancy cars do nothing for me even though I wouldn't say no to one, but rather see money in a different light for what it offers and not what it could buy. Money these days does not burn a hole in my pocket and prefer stacking and saving instead of spending. I do think nearly 6 years on Hive accumulating is a good lesson for anyone in how a typical savings account should be managed and what is possible over the time period.

👍 tarazkp

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@tarazkp · Nov 30 '23

$0.15

>Money these days does not burn a hole in my pocket and prefer stacking and saving instead of spending.

I think this has to do with experience and of course, getting into a position where scarcity isn't the norm. I feel scarcity mindsets tend to have the opposite effect than saving - it is "spend now before it is gone".

👍 cryptoandcoffee

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@haveyoursay · Nov 30 '23 (edited)

10k Euro?
That more than my 54 months of salary.

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@tarazkp · Nov 30 '23

Where are you based?

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@indiaunited · Nov 30 '23

Indiaunited Curation 1701342021982

This post has been manually curated by @steemflow from Indiaunited community. Join us on our [Discord Server](https://discord.gg/bGmS2tE). 

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<sub>**100% of the rewards from this comment goes to the curator for their manual curation efforts. Please encourage the curator @steemflow by upvoting this comment and support the community by voting the posts made by @indiaunited.**</sub>

properties (22)

@jfang003 · Dec 1 '23

$0.10

The stereo type is there, but if you don't save or build a buffer, you can easily get in trouble. After all, you might lose you job at any point because the economy could be bad. I think that is why it doesn't hurt to move against the stereotype.

👍 tarazkp

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properties (23)vote details (1)

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tarazkp	0 B		210,551,808,583	9%

@tarazkp · Dec 1 '23

>I think that is why it doesn't hurt to move against the stereotype.

And, this leads into the conversation about how people identify with "what they are", essentially demanding to be stereotyped based on labels that they don't actually adhere to with their behaviors.

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@kawsar8035 · Nov 30 '23

$0.10

Even if someone earns €10,000 it seems to me that one's life depends on it at the individual level.  Some are satisfied with a small salary and some cannot be happy even with several times more.  It totally depends on the individual.  To be honest, I have heard from people who are earning double or more than me that they don't have any money at the end of the month.  There are many more people who work low paying jobs but they make it through the month very well.

👍 tarazkp

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@tarazkp · Nov 30 '23

Our habits matter and I think that those who have gone through enough lean times and survived, learn to be a bit thriftier. When money comes to easily to someone, they tend to waste it.

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@outwars · Dec 1 '23

$0.10

A 3x salary does sound nice. But I think some people consider it bigger than it actually is. It also depends on the person getting that increase. As you've said, you would probably work on your debt, and pretty much keep your current lifestyle. If it was a person living paycheck to paycheck, suddenly getting 10k a month, I would assume they wouldn't splurge it on vacations or yachts or lake houses. If they were sensible, they would spend it on a good base first. A reasonable house, pay off any debts, put some in savings. They can live better, but I don't think they can live lavishly.

👍 tarazkp

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@tarazkp · Dec 1 '23

>suddenly getting 10k a month, I would assume they wouldn't splurge it on vacations or yachts or lake houses.

I have seen it happen a few times. I know a couple people who at my age, still live relatively paycheck to paycheck, even though they earn significantly more than I do.

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@rafzat · Nov 30 '23

$0.10

10k Euro is a whole lot of money. If you know how much money some people are earning here in Nigeria, you’d pity them. Well, things are quite cheap but not all things. 
Would you believe that our minimum wage is $33? My salary is $100. It is really crazy.
I would not even like to calculate how many of my salary can be deducted from 10k Euro
It is really crazy, lol

👍 tarazkp

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@tarazkp · Nov 30 '23

This is why it has to be looked at from a local level - comparing dollar for dollar makes no sense. It is hard to understand until experiencing living/shopping in each country. I have got used to the prices now as I work here, but when I arrived, everything was twice as expensive at least.

👍 rafzat

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@rafzat · Nov 30 '23

Hmm
You’re Making sense here
You’re right though

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@santigs · Nov 30 '23

$0.14

That is a question I used to ask myself a few years ago. Maybe not with three times my salary but getting a prize in the lottery or something similar. After dreaming about what I would purchase or do, I always ended up with the same conclusion; put the money on an investment vehicle for a few months where I could not touch it. Not so much for the APR, which could also be nice, but to give me time to really value what was important or not, what was necessary for living or just a stupid impulsive purchase. A time window helps you eliminate impulsive choices and make better decisions, or even search for professional help if you do not have the knowledge to decide.

👍 tarazkp, elsurtidor

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@tarazkp · Nov 30 '23

>A time window helps you eliminate impulsive choices and make better decisions, or even search for professional help if you do not have the knowledge to decide.

This is a very important aspect! Just imagine how much *some people* would lose if there was an instant powerdown. There would be people who get gains of course, but emotional people often make silly decisions and FOMO is real.

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@urrirru · Nov 30 '23

$0.10

I recently read about the Russian writer Ivan Bunin. He received the Nobel Prize in 1933 and after 6 years he needed money again.

👍 tarazkp

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@tarazkp · Nov 30 '23

Crazy, isn't it? I was reading about an ex- Australia football captain, who was earning 50K a week and was bankrupt a few years later.

👍 urrirru

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@vcelier · Nov 30 '23

$0.44

The average salary in British Columbia is CAD$53,000 per year. A *3x salary* would be CAD$13,250 per month. Ten years ago, I was earning more than that: CAD$16,000 per month. So, I know what it is to earn more than three times the local average salary.

I did not buy a new car. The car I drive here, my wife bought it in 2009.

I spent the money carefully. In particular, I paid the mortgage on the house I had bought in 2006. It was not a new house, and it is near a lake, but you cannot see the lake from the house. There were houses of the same size with lake views, but they were twice as much.

I also invested in cryptos in 2016/2017, because I knew that if I lost the CAD$47,000 that I used to buy cryptos, I would survive.

I also spent money to improve the family house that we own my sibling and me in France. This morning again, one of my brothers thanked me for doing this.

In fact, what I thought I would do is exactly what I actually did: spend the money carefully and not get into more debt.

👍 acidyo, tarazkp, elsurtidor, holbein81

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@tarazkp · Nov 30 '23

$0.39

>I spent the money carefully. In particular, I paid the mortgage on the house I had bought in 2006.

This is the "biggest purchase" in our lives, but really, it is the largest and longest debt for most of us. Paying it off as fast as possible means having that freedom of capital after. For instance, buying cryptos knowing that you aren't going to lose your house if it doesn't pan out. 

I am not there yet.

Which region of France is your family from? I haven't travelled much there, but I really enjoy it :)

>In fact, what I thought I would do is exactly what I actually did: spend the money carefully and not get into more debt.

Mind me asking, how long you were in the army for? I have found over the years that ex-military people tend to have more discipline than the average. Even in Finland where the compulsory service is only 6 months, there seems to be a bit more discipline here than for instance in Australia.

👍 acidyo, vcelier, holbein81

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@vcelier · Nov 30 '23

$0.10

> Which region of France is your family from?

My father was born in Paris. My mother was the daughter of a Navy officer and was born in Brest, in Brittany. I was born in Paris too.

My children were born in Haiti and Cameroon. They are not my biological children.

> Mind me asking, how long you were in the army for?

I never was in the Army! ;-) I was a Navy officer for 20 years, 1968-1988.

In France, military service has been cancelled in 1997-1997. When I was 19, at the French Naval Academy (l’École Navale), the compulsory military service was 16 months.

👍 tarazkp

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5 replies